What should be the next step for the Scottish giants?
The FA's board has made it publicly clear that they would not sanction the Old Firm clubs joining the Football League either next season or in any other season.
Representatives from the two clubs recently held talks with Nationwide League about the possibility of them playing in Division One, but that now seems like a distant prospect.
The Old Firm may now be forced to stay put in Scotland, make their peace with the other 10 clubs and re-open discussions for a new TV deal.
Should they be allowed to head south?
This debate is now closed. A selection of your e-mails appear below.
It's about time Rangers and Celtic put some money into the other Scots teams instead of crawling on their hands and knees to join the English League.
Mal Walker, Australia
Entry into the first division for the allocated Scottish clubs, then maybe if they are good enough on to play the big boys of English football - Man U and the Arsenal.
Neil, Manchester
The FA should be taken to the European Court, sued into extinction and hung out to dry like the bunch of closed-shop, self-serving dilettantes that they have always been.
They have absolutely no legal right to make such statements, nor do they have the financial muscle so to do.
I sincerely hope that at least six top English clubs trash the FA Cup next season by 'resting' themselves from the tournament, thereby wiping out any potential new sponsors.
Let the FA find out whose money REALLY talks: theirs or that of the 1 million plus fans.
Rhys Jaggar, England
Nobody should be fooled here that when SKY TV decide, that they want the Old Firm should play in England (Premiership or Nationwide League) so be it. Economics have taken over football very firmly and the footballing powers of the past know this very well. So every statementfrom the footballing "Think Tanks" should be seen in right context.
Harry Hacker, Germany
To all the people saying negative things: Why not let the Scots in after all we've already got three Welsh teams in? Don't be silly asking them to start in Division three. Have you never heard of "exceptional circumstances" which this surely is. They won't be taking any other clubs place, because the 1st division is being increased to 26 teams. Finally with Rangers and Celtic in the Nationwide league we would surely get a better TV deal.
B.Cowan,
U.K.
What is to stop Rangers, Celtic and a few of the other European major teams from minor leagues playing in a league? Who needs UEFA, FIFA, SFA or whoever? The fan base is there, the teams are there, so TV and sponsorship can't be too far behind. Why not operate outside FIFA/UEFA?
Andy, Yorkshire
The FA's comments stink of double standards to me. Berwick Rangers are located in England but play their football in the Scottish Football League. Why can't the reverse be true for Scottish clubs playing in England?
Martin Smith, England
It's about time England got to experience the bigotry associated with the Old Firm. I'm a supporter of Kilmarnock, and can't wait until they go down south. I seem to get the impression that English people think fans of the other Scottish clubs are desperate for the Old Firm to stay, but this is baloney.
80% of non-Old Firm fans want them to move. Teams like Man Utd will thrash the Old Firm week in, week out, that is a certainty.
Mark, Scotland
All this Old Firm talk is rubbish. Why do they continue to think of themselves as major players in Europe? You only have to look at Wolves to see that a big support and big money players do not give a team a divine right to be in the premiership.
The only reason why they are currently so far in front in Scotland is that they have been spending way above what they actually have. I don't think that is the basis for being accepted into the Premiership.
Colin, UK
Celtic and Rangers have totally outgrown the rest of Scottish football. The Old Firm giants have been lacking real competition for several years now, and if they do not move from the current position they will become progressively weaker.
The potential for both clubs to flourish into European forces with is great, but only if they are able to move to a more competitive league.
Jim,
Scotland
To Michael, England (below). I note that non-league Celtic have now whipped Man Utd, Fulham, Sunderland, Leeds and drawn with Arsenal this season. Lucky they don't play down in your wee league after all.
Gerry,
Scotland
I think it's wonderful that the FA have said that Celtic and Rangers will not be allowed to join the Nationwide. They have been greedy for years in Scottish football, and now the other teams are fighting back they want to come to England. They should sort out their problems in Scotland, which is where they belong.
Carole Hicks
Carole Hicks,
UK
Three cheers for the FA for not sanctioning Celtic and Rangers' entry into the English League system. Given the common sense reflected in the FA's straightforward announcement, I am even thinking of supporting the FA's own representatives in the World Cup!
Jimmy, Scotland
First it was the Atlantic league, then the Euro league, FA Premiership, Phoenix league and finally the Nationwide - all have come to nothing. The next step is to have an SPL of just two. The other 10 SPL clubs should now resign and consign the Old Firm to history.
Mac, Scotland
As stated before, I am against Celtic and Rangers joining the Football League (for reasons of fairness to the English and Scottish clubs), but I think the FA have got it wrong. If the "pyramid" is only for English and Welsh clubs, what are Gretna doing in the Unibond League? Annan Athletic also played in an English local league for a while.
The FA originally had a large number of Scottish clubs as members including, Queens Park and Glasgow Rangers. It was never intended to be an "English only" organisation.
Berwick Rangers (England) play in the Scottish League and Gateshead have applied to join in the past. Whilst they were unsuccessful, there were no legal impediments to them joining if invited.
The FA are entitled to state their opinion, but I cannot believe it is true that the Football League is for "English and Welsh clubs only". If so, don't the Football League bigwigs know their own rules? What would happen if the Scottish League folded altogether? Would the FA prevent Scottish clubs joining the Pyramid at whatever level? And would they be in restraint of trade if they did?
Neil,
England
Celtic and Rangers will be playing in a more competitive league within a few years, that's without doubt. That league will be either British or European. Celtic supporters especially have invested in their club, their team and their stadium. They are among the top five clubs in Britain, have a huge brand name and fill their stadium at every home game. They want to develop further, and who could blame them?
Those who are frightened at the prospect of having the Old Firm play in their leagues see only threats to their cosy world, not opportunities. What have they got to lose for goodness sake?
The Old Firm are prepared to give up European involvement until they have proved themselves in a lesser league, and to stake everything on getting to the Premiership in one season. What a prospect for football, yet the 'whingers' prevail.
Ian McLaren,
Scotland
Atlantic League it is then! Moving to England would be great for the Old Firm, but completely unfair to the other Nationwide clubs. There are a host of other clubs in Europe in the same situation as Celtic and Rangers - Benfica, Ajax, Rosenborg etc.
They should all get together and start this league, with or without Uefa's permission. If Uefa bans these clubs, so what? Surely the revenue would be greater than that of the Champions League anyway. It's all about money, and the Atlantic League will make money. Celtic v Dumfermline matches do not. Leave now.
Mark, USA
Let them come. Rangers and Celtic will find their own level, whatever that may be. What is more debilitating for Scottish football is this constant speculation. While the future of the Old Firm is still up in the air, the SPL will find it impossible to secure a media deal for next season.
Mark Colburn, England
Rangers and Celtic enhance the Premiership? In three or four years they will still be floundering mid table in the First Division and then all the talk will be about how they want to go back and play in Scotland.
It would be a bit harsh to make them start in the Conference considering that they already play non-league football, but make them start in Division Three and work their way up. They have absolutely no right to go straight into Division One.
Michael, England
As a Baggies fan, it sounds like we got out of Division One just in time. However, the premiership has 20 clubs, and Division One 24. Over two years, four teams will go up from div 1, with three relegated from the premiership - until 22 teams are in each division.
This would also deal with the immediate problem of the foregone conclusion of promotion for Rangers & Celtic to the Premiership, leaving two other places for the remaining teams.
Chris,
Jersey, CI
Uefa are in no position to complain about the Scottish clubs qualifying for Europe via the English Premiership, assuming they join that league and qualify for Europe on merit.
Uefa continually change the qualification criteria for the Champions League to ensure that more places are available for the "elite" clubs - regardless of whether they are actually Champions of their own domestic league.
It is inequitable for Uefa to change rules for their own benefit, but then to refuse Rangers and Celtic the right to move leagues in order to further their ambitions.
They should also consider the existing precedent of Welsh-based clubs playing in English competitions, together with an English based club (Berwick Rangers) playing in the Scottish league.
David,
Scotland
If the Old Firm want to play in England and the Nationwide League accepts them, surely no-one can stand in their way. Uefa wouldn't have a hope of preventing them if the case went to the European courts, as they would be imposing a restriction of trade. All of the clubs would be much better off through television and sponsorship deals, and nothing can stand in the way of money!
John Jivanandham,
Scotland
Celtic and Rangers find themselves in a position of their own making. They both require more revenue as they are in the red and losing money as we speak. This is because they have bought expensive players from home and abroad to try and get success in the Champions league - something they have failed to do.
The lack of competition in Scotland is a complete red herring; the old Firm have always dominated in Scotland, and in this respect Scotland is no different from most European countries that tend to be dominated by one or two teams.
Even in England the game is dominated by a handful of teams. The desire to leave the Scottish league is driven by money, or more bluntly, greed.
Donald Munn,
Scotland
Sure, let Celtic and Rangers come to English football - as long as they are treated just like any other English club. Let's see how they like starting in the Beazer Homes Southern Division Two, like any other new English club would have to.
But go straight into Division One? No way. It's totally unfair to all of the other clubs that work so hard to get there, only to see their hopes brushed aside by the rich boys wanting a slice of a bigger pie.
Paul Shrimpton, UK
Uefa cannot ignore this. European football has to restructure to move club football forward. With players crossing international boundaries, the idea of national leagues is patently nonsensical. Club competitions have to be restructured as competitive pyramids - yes, it's time for a European league.
John, England
I hear Celtic and Rangers may be joining Division One next season. If that it the case, what happens to my team, Reading, who have just been promoted to that division?
They have worked hard for that promotion, as have Brighton and Stoke. There needs to be notice of these things - e.g. at the end of 2002-03 only one side goes up from Division Two. You cannot change the rules now!
Douglas, Reading, England
If Rangers and Celtic leave the SPL, would that mean they couldn't represent Scotland in European Competitions? If so, that would put Livingston and Aberdeen in the Champions League and Hearts and Dunfermline in the UEFA Cup.
As an Aberdeen fan, I'm not sure if I want to see my team on the biggest stage getting slaughtered.
Stephen, Scotland
What a ridiculous idea. What then for the Division One clubs? They find it hard enough to gain promotion, only to be pitted against the Old Firm. It's not an English league if Scottish clubs play in it - this should not go ahead.
Matt Malone, England
If Celtic and Rangers join the Nationwide League it will be an absolute disgrace. As an Ipswich fan, the last thing I would want is two top teams competing against us for the promotion places.
It is utterly unfair, and there would be tremors that would hit every club in the Nationwide. Even if they were put into the Conference, it would be unfair for those teams.
Toby Evans, UK
Celtic and Rangers are certainly good enough in football terms to go straight into the premiership. Anyone who doubts this should take a look at the video of the Leeds v Celtic match last week.
Uefa could hardly object to a move as Cardiff, Derry City and Monaco amongst - many other teams - all play in leagues outside their own country.
However, I am totally against Celtic and Rangers joining the Football League. For one, it's unfair on the other English teams who have been struggling for years to get out of the divisions they are in. The Old Firm are Scottish teams, and should be doing their best to raise the standards of the game in Scotland.
I would welcome a limited involvement by Scottish and English teams in a revamped Worthington Cup, with an extra Uefa Cup place to the winners. This would bring in extra revenue without disrupting the structure of the game in either England or Scotland.
Neil,
England
I sincerely hope that Celtic and Rangers join the Nationwide and then the English Premiership. I also wish that Hearts and Hibs would do the same. The top two or three leagues should be British and then let the other national leagues be feeders into them. Let economics take its course!
John,
GB
As a Scot (Celtic fan) living down south, I see the benefit of Celtic and Rangers moving south as being two fold: in the first instance it will be of financial benefit to both in the long run and secondly maybe, just maybe, the bigotry that has been endemic in Scotland for so long may lose it's place once they are not challenging each other for the title, but several others.
It saddens me when all I read is the fact that the fans of both still seem to be so one track minded that their prime concern is beating the other team. Unfortunately the David Murrays and Dermot Desmonds don't quite see it that way. Rangers are currently spending 87% of their turnover on wages, how can that be maintained? Answer-It can't. Each team knows the only way to progress is either to stay in Scotland and progress (this is a must) in the Champions league, or go down south.
Figures of £75M are being thrown around as their value to the Nationwide League-as far as TV money is concerned, and therefore they would receive part of that, and of course they would be looking at promotion to the gold mine that is the premiership. I do sympathise with the other 10 teams but it does seem a bit rich when they, on the one hand say to C&R that "here is a deal, take it or leave it" but on the other blame Celtic for causing the collapse of the Sky deal.
Paul Mclachlan,
England
The money men on both sides of the border may want Celtic and Rangers in the English first division, but you should have no doubt that English fans most definitely do not. If there is a spare place in the football league then it should go to a team which has earned it, such as Dagenham and Redbridge.
Scottish teams, stay in your own country and sort out your own problems, don't bring them down here and expect us to bail you out. The Old Firm need England, we certainly don't need them.
Alan, England
If Rangers and Celtic do leave the SPL the financial implications for the remaining clubs are horrendous. Wage bills will be cut and clubs will find it very difficult to import talent. They may even have to implement a youth policy aimed at bringing our own youngsters through instead of buying off-the-shelf has-beens.
Rangers and Celtic will also suffer as their fans, fed on a diet of domestic success, realise that their teams are not as good as they think. Finally, having to travel out of Glasgow every other week will test the navigation skills of even the most hardened Old Firm supporter. They find it hard enough to get home from Perth and that's only 50 miles from Glasgow!
Martyn Armstrong, UK
I have just listened to an interview with Charlie Nicholas regarding the talk of Celtic possibly joining the Nationwide League. In my opinion Celtic would absolutely whoop all the Nationwide Leagues teams. If they are to join the English League then only the Premiership would do. Any other league they will walk.
Donna, England-Bristol
The Old Firm have been bleeding the Scottish game dry for over a decade. Once they leave there may be a less interested stance taken by the public for a while, but since no team will dominate the league it will make for more interesting viewing. Sky TV may even renew their interest in the Scottish game.
William Low,
Scotland
Times change and big money talks. Rangers & Celtic will never submit to anything but a plan designed to continue their financial growth, prosperity and prestige whether the latter is more imagined than real. The world is growing smaller and very soon web cams, etc, will enhance our lives by showing big games live on the Internet and so on. Within five to ten years the Old Firm will be firmly entrenched in either English Soccer or some form of European League and that is a fact.
Roderick Rhodes, Canada
If the international football authorities do not allow a European league such as the 'Atlantic' league to flourish then it is inevitable that Scottish football will continue to decline. The population of Scotland, outside Glasgow, is insufficient to support a league that can compete with other European countries or clubs. Football talent will not be attracted to stay in Scotland because the financial structure of the game will be so dire.
An 'Atlantic' league with the top Scottish Clubs participation is the only answer.
Paul Bradley, England
If this move goes ahead, we might as well have a British League and be done with it.
Paul Tubb, Wales
Why should Celtic and Rangers be offered places in the First Division? They should start in the Conference and earn promotion through the leagues like every other team has to.
Steve, S. Wales
Scottish football will survive. Many of the teams probably won't and to my mind that's not a bad thing. Scotland can't support 42 teams. Ideally some of the smaller teams would merge but if they wont then they will disappear.
The old firm take a large amount of responsibility for this for their continued greed in terms of wanting the television revenue and take more by their repeated hijacks of the proposed television deals. Their ulterior motives are laid bare and it really doesn't make them look good.
Andrew B Davidson, Australia
As a Motherwell fan, I'll be only too happy to see the back of the Old Firm. It'll make the league so much more competitive, without the demand for expensive foreign players. Instead young Scottish players will see more action - it can only be a good thing for the national team.
In the short run, it will be financially painful, something Motherwell has already started to prepare for. The other clubs will have to follow suit and trim their wage bill too. But there is a future where any team in the top league could win the championship, not just the Terrible Twosome!
Ross Brooker, England
The solution is a British league. Scottish football is boring and one-sided. I don't see the problem with Scottish clubs and English clubs playing together. It would attract a lot more interest and strengthen the teams of both countries. Fifa should not have a problem with it - after all Cardiff and Swansea are already playing in the English leagues and yet they are Welsh!
Matt, New Zealand
The number of professional football clubs in Scotland is ridiculous for a country its size. Compare with London which has a roughly equal population. It is high time to thin the herd a little. Football is part of the entertainment industry and as such must compete with movies etc. for people's leisure time and money. Apart from the Old Firm and die-hard fans of the lesser clubs there is no competition at all. Over-priced tickets, second rate players and a league that is over by October are hardly very exciting.
Greig Chisholm,
UK
Scottish football will survive. For too long the provisional clubs have tried to play alongside the disproportionate strength of the Old Firm. Yet with the Glasgow two relentlessly dominating the Scottish scene it is time they left and the remaining sides competed in a relatively even field.
Scottish clubs would be forced to field domestic home grown talent and whilst this might return the days of the 1960s and beyond to represent a breeding ground for sowing ripe talent to harvested by the English clubs, it would at least guarantee a new vein of Scottish players that can only strengthen the Scottish game and national team as a whole and bring new excitement to the domestic game.
A League where any of the top 12 could win the league and any of the top 12 could face relegation - doesn't that lay down the foundation for a real and meaningful competitive league and isn't the domestic fare far more important than the occasional successful foray into Europe?
Eddie Brennan,
Scotland
There is no more of a crisis in Scottish football than there is in the English Leagues. Certainly something needs to be done to stem the growing division between the Old Firm and the other Scottish teams. A fairer, more equitable split of TV revenue would be a start. If Celtic and Rangers cross the border to play then Scottish football will be relegated to that of Welsh or Irish football and only of interest to a very localised support.
Colin Smith,
A Scot in Houston, USA
If Welsh teams can play in the English league and still have their own national team, then why can't the Scots?
Richard Hughson,
UK
It's hardly a national game anymore! How many players in either Celtic or Rangers are actually Scottish? In fact, there are so many foreign players in the Premiership; it's hard to tell which league you are watching. Quite frankly I've lost interest in the whole thing, the whole game is driven by money - if you have got it you in, if not, you are out.
Keith,
England
I would love to see Celtic and Rangers in the English top flight. Yes it would seem unfair to the likes of Wolves who have been trying for a long time to gain promotion however, what matters is the game and the supporters. We deserve to see the best and that includes the old firm. I would gladly take all that back if the much talked about Super League was born.
Phil,
Australia
Celtic and Rangers would struggle in the Premiership and their attendances would plummet. Remember how many Rangers fans were at Ibrox in the couple of seasons before Souness arrived? Virtually every one of the 50,000 who now go to Ibrox claim they were one of the 10,000 who were at some of these games!
Jambo,
Scotland
If Celtic and Rangers do not wish to play in the SPL, which they clearly do not, then they should be removed from the fixture list forthwith. Why should I pay money to watch my team play against teams who are only turning up because they can't get a game anywhere else. It's not that they are playing at a level far superior to everyone else, eg on Wednesday night I watched Hibernian F.C. draw 1 - 1 with Rangers at Ibrox.
John,
Scotland
If Rangers and Celtic join the English leagues then will big teams who dominate Portugal such as Benfica and Porto join the Spanish league, or big Austrian teams join the German league. What is the point of a national game if it becomes international.
Neil, England,
England
The fact the Premiership had a vote on the issue is major progress.
Rangers and Celtic WILL be playing Premiership football in three years time once the current TV deal has run out. Remember you heard it here first.
Derek,
Scotland
I don't know why the Old Firm would want to waste their time playing "Mickey Mouse" teams in England in a second rate league. They can do that in Scotland. When the TV deals are renegotiated in a couple of years, the FA will go to Rangers and Celtic (cap in hand), and beg them to join the Premiership. Only Man Utd have greater commercial appeal than either half of the Old Firm.
Rob,
UK
As a Celtic fan I feel it is a great opportunity missed as it would breath some life into a league which despite a likely close finish this year has began to lose its sparkle in commercial and media terms.
Michael,
England
The Premier League should never say never. When the bubble bursts in a few years time they may change their minds.
Kelly,
Scotland
I find it absolutely hilarious that Rangers expect to join the English Premiership, particularly at a time when their second place in the SPL is under threat from teams such as Aberdeen and Livingston.
Chris Roy,
Scotland
Celtic and Rangers should leave Scotland even if it means playing in the English first division because they would go straight up anyway. They need to play constantly at a higher level to compete in Europe. Also the game in Scotland may flourish because of this.
Kristian,
Ireland
How cares about the Premiership? If they can't see a good thing when offered, so be it. Celtic and Rangers would eventually get bored playing the likes of Derby, Charlton and Leicester and may as well be playing Dundee who would give them a better game!!
I think that the suggestion of a European league is the way forward. Imagine the crowds and television viewers for Celtic vs AC Milan or Rangers vs Liverpool, week in week out. The Old Firm should join a European league and then see how many Premiership clubs desert a sinking ship!
Henrik,
Sweden
Perform in the Uefa Cup and Champions League and earn some respect instead of moaning about the Premiership.
Andrew,
UK
Rangers and Celtic are big clubs, but they don't have a divine right to a seat at the top table. If they want to join the Premier League they should prove they are worthy by earning promotion from the Nationwide League. Many clubs like Wolves have been fighting to get into the Premier League, without success, for years, and it would make a mockery of their efforts if the Scottish clubs could be "elected" to the Premier League.
Darren,
Isle of man
English clubs are just running scared of The Old Firm. Bringing with them two quality sides and a fanatical support the likes of which can only be matched in South America. The Old Firm would not only enhance The Premiership but would soon be challenging for the title itself.
Peter McAllister,
Scotland
Who needs the Premiership? What is required is a restructuring of the Champions League and Uefa Cup to ensure the Old Firm get to play more games against the bigger clubs and hence earn more money. The Old Firm are too big to be snubbed by the English. Celtic have made incredible advances already without the "assistance" of the English Premiership.
Paul Camplin,
England
So the Chairmen have given the Premier League a vote of confidence!
This means the current league will be replaced in a month or so's time with something new.
Colin McCosh,
UK
A step too far? What did they expect? They should be told that if they want to join the Premiership, they should start in Division Four like any other new team. The SFA should also step in and tell them to either stop moaning like kids not allowed on a school trip, or get out!
Dasbo,
Scotland
Celtic and Rangers and a number of other top European clubs, including the big English, French, Spanish, German and Italian clubs, should form a breakaway league of their own. Not a new idea but one that increasingly makes sense. Surely everybody would much rather be watching Liverpool or Celtic play the likes of Real Madrid or Juventus week in week out, instead of Derby or Dundee.
Matthew,
England