Europe South Asia Asia Pacific Americas Middle East Africa BBC Homepage World Service Education
BBCi CATEGORIES   TV   RADIO   COMMUNICATE   WHERE I LIVE   INDEX    SEARCH 

BBC NEWS
 You are in: Talking Point
Front Page 
World 
UK 
UK Politics 
Business 
Sci/Tech 
Health 
Education 
Entertainment 
Talking Point 
Forum 
In Depth 
AudioVideo 


Commonwealth Games 2002

BBC Sport

BBC Weather

SERVICES 
Friday, 7 September, 2001, 09:04 GMT 10:04 UK
Should the law recognise gay relationships?
Two gay couples in London have "married" in a unique ceremony.

Their relationships will be entered into the London Partnerships Register, an initiative of the capital's mayor, Ken Livingstone.

The register - the first of its kind in the UK - does not confer any legal rights, but supporters hope it will help in disputes over housing, taxation, inheritance rights and pensions.

They also see it as a small step towards full equality with heterosexual relationships.

Gay couples say they face financial and legal uncertainties because the law does not recognise their unions.

Should the scheme be adopted elsewhere in the country? Should same-sex relationships have the same legal standing as heterosexual ones?

This debate is now closed. Read a selection of your comments below.


Your reaction

As far as I can see, gay marriages hurt no one, and will make a lot of people happy, not to mention the legal advantages for people who choose to enter into them. Surely this should be the main consideration of society.
Amanda, Thailand


The issue is about respect for all people regardless of sexual orientation

Mark, England
I am not convinced that the focus is purely one of marriage in the traditional sense. The issue is about respect for all people regardless of sexual orientation. The legal requirements regarding pension rights, next of kin and employee benefits are the crucial factor. Many heterosexual couples no longer see the importance of the symbolism of marriage but are protected by the law with regards to the above-mentioned issues. I don't think the sanctity of marriage argument counts as the general heterosexual population regardless of religion are not doing a great job of upholding it.
Mark, England

I think those who say that their gay partner can't inherit anything are wrong. They ought to see a solicitor and write a will. They'll find they can leave their money to just about anyone they please. Gay marriage would however make it harder to write their ex-partner out of such a will.
Dennis, England

Gay marriages SHOULD be recognised if we are to respect each other's right to choose who we love and how. Surely this is a fundamental human right? I am heterosexual and my partner and I are now making plans for our wedding, and feel that people should not be denied this right to choose who and how they love because of their sexuality.
Sue, UK


Gay people should be allowed to seek happiness just like every one of us!

Tuomo Tanskanen, Finland
Personally I think that gay marriages should be allowed. It would make the economic life of the gay couples easier and I think it would be the humane thing to do. Gay people are humans too, and they don't need just to be with other gay people, they need to feel that their feelings are ok, acceptable. Gay people should be allowed to seek happiness just like every one of us!
Tuomo Tanskanen, Finland

All partnerships should be recognised under the law not only gay ones. There are far too many people who have lost their beliefs about marriage to ignore the fact that it's an outmoded institution. It's about time we stopped living in the past.
Jacky, UK

If you allow gay couples the same rights where do you stop? You will allow heterosexual couples who live together the same rights next. They want all the good points about marriage but not the 'bad' ones (in their eyes). The commitment. The fact that if they want to end the relationship they will have to get a divorce. They want to be able to walk away when they feel like it and have no come back. I disagree with homosexual relationships on religious grounds. I still believe in God even if there are few Christians around. Therefore disagree with homosexual marriages even if they do want to commit themselves to each other.
J, England

Long-term same sex relationships should have equivalent legal status to heterosexual relationships. Partners should have equivalent pension rights, and be able to succeed to council tenancies, etc. So should unmarried heterosexual couples in an established relationship. Marriage per se is an outmoded, patriarchal institution and couples should not be obliged to subscribe to it for the sake of gaining the above mentioned and similar rights.
D Rodriguez, UK


A same sex relationship simply falls outside the scope of marriage

R. Cliffe, UK
Marriage is an institution created by societies to support families, protect children and reduce the risk of violence by limiting competition for mates. It generally confers social status on the partners in return for certain obligations that society needs honoured. Birth control and greater financial independence has reduced the importance of marriage to women to a degree but it remains a central pillar in our society and a control over behaviour (with numerous exceptions). A same sex relationship simply falls outside the scope of marriage if you accept this societal/functional view.
R. Cliffe, UK

I am a Catholic and extremely happy with my girlfriend. However I see no substantial statistical indicators suggesting that heterosexual unions lead overwhelmingly to human satisfaction nor happiness, as witness the alarmingly high divorce rate. If gay couples can find happiness within their union then to me that is wonderful and I certainly believe equal rights in law are just and indeed, in time, inevitable
Anthony, England

Ken Livingstone's purely symbolic gay "partnership register" has already achieved its first goal: to get the issue into the mainstream media. Let's keep it there until until the law is changed to acknowledge the validity of gay relationships.
Olivier Weber, UK


I hope the whole country will soon follow suit

Nigel Okelo, Canada
Welcome to the 21st century London. I hope the whole country will soon follow suit. I have been living in this wonderful country called Canada that as far as I am concerned is far and away one of the pioneering countries when it comes to gay issues. We are not there yet but we are making great strides here and I am glad to see the UK giving recognition to issues that should have been addressed decades ago. May all who take this wonderful opportunity of being legally together have a wonderful and fruitful life together.
Nigel Okelo, Canada

I have been with my partner for nearly ten years yet if I were to marry someone of the opposite sex tomorrow, even a complete stranger, that person would automatically have more rights than my partner in a range of important areas including inheritance, death benefits and access to me and what should happen to me should I be seriously ill in hospital. I fail to see why we (and for that matter heterosexuals who choose not to marry) should be prevented from entering into a contract, religious or otherwise, which ends this anomaly.
Paul Rayton, UK

If gays are happy to accept the "responsibilities" that go with these rights (.ie. if there's to be a gay divorce someone will lose a house and if lesbians split there may be a custody dispute over children) then go for it and good luck. It's so easy to market the gay lifestyle and demand rights on TV. Making them work in practice once you've got them is much harder but that long-term practical view is nearly always ignored by the gay community.
Ken, UK


I think this is long overdue

Paul Stafford, England
I think this is long overdue, my partner and I will be watching keenly and hope to be able to confirm our love for each other by following suit shortly.
Paul Stafford, England

Yes, yes, yes!
Brian Boyd, Wales

There also exists the sad irony that if one of the gay partners is transsexual, then a marriage is indeed recognised by the law, because the transsexual partner is treated by this country as being of the sex on the birth certificate, not the actual sex of the individual's experience.
Joan, UK

As a gay man, I am discriminated against in almost every area of my life. Under the current laws, when I die my ex-wife will inherit al my worldly goods whilst my long-term partner (a man) will get nothing, despite the fact that we have been together for almost twenty years. As far as I am concerned, the London Partnerships will go some considerable way to rectifying the huge chasm between recognition of gay and straight relationships.
Robert White, UK

You mean treat everyone the same and give equal human rights? Golly, that's a bit radical!
James Ingram, Australia


Yes, if two people want to commit themselves to each other for life then they should

Jo Avery, UK
Yes, if two people love and care for each other and want to commit themselves to each other for life (ie marriage) then they should. As for finances etc, there is no law for any couple that aren't married that covers such things, but that's another debate. All these people that say No it's a perversion - loving and caring for someone else is the most natural and beautiful thing in the world, no matter what gender either of you are.
Jo Avery, UK

Any commitment that human beings make to each other should be recognised and celebrated.
Stephen, UK

I fail to see any fairness in the current situation. I could marry the woman I fall in love with, so why can't my neighbour marry the man he falls in love with? It's absurd. We need to be an open, fair country and not be plagued by religious dogma from an age long gone.
Alex White, UK


There is no legitimate reason for confining this right to the heterosexual majority

Eme, UK
A civil marriage ceremony is no more than a private contractual arrangement between two consenting loving adults, which is recognised at law. There is no legitimate reason for confining this right to contract in this manner to the heterosexual majority. It is a nonsense to argue that straight co-habitees are similarly disadvantaged by society because this ceremony is open to them.

In addition, the law provides them with a number of protections that same sex partners do not have. Homosexuality is a natural state and has been present in human society since it began. To discriminate against it is to deny what is human nature and is thoroughly reprehensible. In a developed society which prides itself on human rights this is no longer acceptable.
Eme, UK

The fact is, if gay rights are upheld why should not any couple of friends who share a house have legal rights? It will then be discrimination against straight guys to deny them all the advantages given to gays! The fact is that marriage is a unique relationship and there are elements to it that cannot be reproduced. It's those elements that justify its special treatment. But in addition, many gays don't want marriage status if it means that they are to live faithful to the one partner, which after all is at the heart of what marriage is supposed to be about.
Tom Holland, England


I would not like to see churches "marrying" gay couples, that would be wrong

Dave, UK
Being a Christian, I believe that homosexuality is wrong. However, it is not for me to judge these people. I would be perfectly happy to see gay couples given the same legal rights as heterosexual couples. I would not like to see churches "marrying" gay couples, that would be wrong.
Dave, UK

I despair that this still remains an issue in 21st century western civilisation. A gay couple's union is not about religion, walking down the aisle or upsetting the heterosexual community - it should be about equality, human rights and promoting monogamous relationships. I applaud Ken's initiative, but the government should now move to confer legal rights. In not acting it is quietly supporting discrimination.
Lee, New York, USA

No such relationship should be recognised by law in any country because from the beginning marriage is between a man and a woman. No more, no less.
Ngene, R C, Nigeria


Of course there should be legal recognition for all relationships

Justin, Sweden
Of course there should be legal recognition for all relationships. The idea that two people can share their lives and property for thirty years and then one of them have no claim on that property if the other dies is obscene. UK law should grow up.
Justin, Sweden

To David K I say, why is homosexuality "abnormal" when history clearly shows that throughout recorded time 5-10% of people have been gay? Being gay is about as abnormal as being blonde.
Angus Gulliver, UK

At present gays do not have the option to marry while heterosexuals do. Yes there is an issue re non-married couples' civil rights but at the end of the day, that can be easily resolved by a trip to the registrar. We have no such option, period.
Angie Jezard, USA


It's no one else's business or concern what gender each partner is

Deb, England
Of course the status should be the same. What difference does it make whether the two people committing to each other are the same gender? What matters is that they wish to make a commitment to each other. It's no one else's business or concern what gender each partner is.
Deb, England

I have to admit I am pleasantly surprised to see that the UK is finally joining the European neighbours in the Gay Relationships debate. I just hope that your government chooses the direction we in Germany, France and Holland have taken. Giving gays the right to choose if they wish to marry or not is the most social and noble thing to do.
Ramón, Germany

Britain, please don't fall behind the rest of Europe here. Obviously the recognition of gay unions will come with time both legally and otherwise. Why not just make a small leap ahead and accept the fact that homosexuality always has been and always will be part of human society?!
Mark, USA

Homosexuality is abnormal and perverse whether one chooses to look at it from a biological, religious or any other perspective, so no amount of spin nor lobbying can change the underlying facts of the matter. If people of the same sex want to live together, let them get on with it - I accept that there is no point trying to stop them. But this is very different from encouraging them to do so or bestowing the concept of "normality" on their abnormal activities.

As for Ken Livingstone, he is playing true to type by deliberately provoking the moral majority of this country by espousing yet another politically correct cause. Has he ever been right about anything?
David K, England


Our descendants will similarly look back in disgust at the time when we denied our fellow human beings equal rights

Andy, Republic of Ireland
Hundreds of years ago the black people of Africa were deemed unworthy of the rights afforded to white Europeans yet today we recoil in horror at the idea of slavery. In time the gay community will gain the same rights as everyone else, and our descendants will similarly look back in disgust at the time when we denied our fellow human beings equal rights.
Andy, Republic of Ireland

I agree with Kate (UK)- but to go one further: Am I the only person who finds it a little absurd that we have entered the 21st century and so many couples (of all sexual orientations) still feel that they need to undergo some sort of outlandish ceremony in order to prove their commitment to one other and, above all, for their union to be legitimised by the state?
Adam, UK

Well of course same sex couples should have the same rights as heterosexual couples. We live in a progressive society. My partner and I will soon celebrate our 30th anniversary with our gay and straight friends. However, if my partner were ill, why should his distant relatives take priority over my presence in the sick room?

Why should they make decisions about his life when I have been his life partner? Why should my rights to his pension benefit be less because we are gay? We are not a threat to heterosexuals - all gay men and women were born from a such a liaison. We do not choose to be gay - we are born gay.
Gary Garfield, Yorkshire, UK


I applaud Ken Livingstone for having the initiative and courage to implement a long-overdue measure

CNS, Durham, England
Once again I applaud Ken Livingstone for having the initiative and courage to implement a long-overdue measure. It is ridiculous that gay couples, even those who expect to spend the rest of their life together, have no rights to basic things such as hospital visits. Now that both the Lib Dems and a major independent are behind this sort of scheme, let's hope the Labour Government has the guts to implement a proper legal scheme for the whole country.
CNS, Durham, England

As a gay man myself and in the same relationship for the past 15 years I fully support the equal rights issue with regard to housing, taxation etc. What I cannot agree with is any notion of "gay marriage". As an unconventional group gay people of either sex don't need to accept the conventions of fellow heterosexuals. We don't need to make vows but where we have demonstrated a commitment to each other and entered into all the trappings that go with that commitment then we should have some legal redress when, like heterosexual couples, things go wrong. Besides which I look terrible in white!
John Taylor, UK

Symbolic as this register is, it is a great stepping stone for gay society, and perhaps after six months, it should be adopted at least by all the major cities of the UK cos we don't all live in London unfortunately. I hope eventually I will be able to marry my partner legally with all the status of the hetero marriage.
Kathleen, London, UK

Britain seems obsessed with discussing "gay rights". How about focussing on getting the divorce rate down rather than further diluting marriage?
Mark Robinson, Netherlands


Whether you'd want Mayor Ken officiating is a different matter

Tim, UK
The only arguments against recognition of gay relationships come from a religious basis. Since it has long been possible to recognise heterosexual relationships on a purely civil and secular basis, there's no reason why this shouldn't be extended to gay people. Indeed, official recognition of these relationships may help to make them more (hate to use the word) 'normal' and decrease prejudice. Whether you'd want Mayor Ken officiating is a different matter, however...
Tim, UK

All unmarried partners face legal uncertainties and inheritance difficulties, not just gay couples. What they are seeking is not equality with heterosexual partnerships, but with heterosexual marriages. I don't see why gay couples should be singled out for such treatment when I, living with a partner, cannot inherit anything of his, not even the house we live in, should something happen to him. If we are to accept this kind of change, then it should apply to all partners who live together regardless of their sexual orientation. The law should be changed to enable anyone who has lived with a partner in a full relationship for a period of time to have the same rights as a married couple in terms of inheritance, taxation and pensions.
Kate, UK

All marriages should be contractual. If people want to also have a religious ceremony, fine. But it is not a proper role of government to reward or punish people based on marital status. This includes taxes, immigration laws, and several other areas.
John, Minneapolis, USA

I have been in a same sex relationship for the last 7 years. As with our heterosexual counterparts we both contribute to society through taxation, direct and indirect. We contribute to our local community and to the wider society around us - yet my partner would not be allowed to sign consent forms in hospital, for example, yet he knows me better than my family. Living wills are all well and good, as long as they are recognised. We don't want different rights, we want equal rights.
Liam, UK


We don't want to walk down the aisle in a pink wedding dress, we just want equal rights

Jamie, England
Laws exist to protect the rights of society and the rights of the individual. It is a commonly felt belief that about 10% of the country is homosexual, so it is only right that the law reflect this. Many people will confuse this issue with another tricky subject: "gay marriage", but these are very different terms. As a gay man in a long-term relationship, I feel it's unacceptable that our rights as a couple are not protected under the law. My partner and I don't need society to happily accept our union, but we do need to feel legally and financially secure and equal to those who are in heterosexual relationships. I just hope that we can follow the example of the Netherlands, Germany and Belgium and finally put this issue to rest. We don't want to walk down the aisle in a pink wedding dress, we just want equal rights.
Jamie, England

Yes. Let's just get on with progress eventually the luddites with come to accept it as perfectly normal.
Binx, UK

Absolutely not! Normal heterosexuals will soon be in the minority and I do not agree with anything that promotes gays. Even top Tory leaders are having to change their stance due to the fear of losing votes.
Cameron Poe, UK

I have learned to become more and more liberal on this particular matter and it is really a simple case of 'each to their own'. I have tried but failed to find a really good reason why these people should not have a recognised civil marriage. If heterosexuals can have it, why shouldn't they?
AH, Scotland

Of course same-sex relationships should have the same legal standing as heterosexual ones. Why shouldn't they? If two people want to share their lives together, the state should support this. Homosexuality is not going to go away and it is high time that gay people have ABSOLUTE EQUALITY under the legal system. Anything less is prejudice.
Kurt, UK


It is irrelevant what gender the two lovers are

Ross, Scotland, UK
What is important in a relationship is love, trust and mutual respect - it is irrelevant what gender the two lovers are. I strongly believe that all relationships based on love should have equal validity under law, regardless of sexuality.
Ross, Scotland, UK

If you deny gay couples equal legal and financial rights and regard their union as a lesser version of a straight one, you may as well take away the rest of their human rights and brand them as sub-humans.
Wendy, UK

If 2 people want to spend the rest of their lives together they should be able to set up a legal union to remove the financial/ legal uncertainties. However I do not believe they should be able to get married in church.
Caron, England

Of course the law should recognise gay relationships. It is hard enough being gay in this country without the law basically deciding it is wrong.
J, UK


The law should reflect reality not distort it

Andy Millward, UK
We're in the 21st century but legislation is stuck in a 19th century time warp. Of course homosexual relationships should be recognised as should heterosexual relationships outside marriage. The law should reflect reality not distort it.
Andy Millward, UK

I am gay and have a partner. I believe the law should be changed so that we can have equal opportunities with heterosexuals. This present law is a bit old fashioned and should be changed.
David Dutton, UK

Yes of course they should. The only differences between a loving homosexual relationship and a loving heterosexual relationship are firstly objection on religious grounds (which most people don't believe in anyway) and secondly that homosexual couples cannot (naturally) produce children, but many heterosexual relationships do not produce children anyway. Most objections to this will be grounded in bigotry or religious beliefs, neither of which should stop Britain developing and moving into the future along with our European neighbours who have already taken this courageous step for human rights.
Steve Hodgson, UK

I don't think homosexual relationships should be 'recognised'. It's a perversion.
Nigel Dams, England

 VOTE RESULTS
Should the law recognise same-sex relationships?

Yes
 69.22% 

No
 30.78% 

3337 Votes Cast

Results are indicative and may not reflect public opinion

See also:

05 Sep 01 | UK
Gay couples to 'wed'
01 Aug 01 | Europe
Germany legalises gay marriage
01 Apr 01 | Europe
Dutch gay couples exchange vows
Internet links:


The BBC is not responsible for the content of external internet sites


Links to more Talking Point stories