BBC Breakfast with Frost interviewed Superintendent Ali Dizaei

On 19 October 2003, Sir David Frost interviewed Superintendent Ali Dizaei - the senior Metropolitan Police Officer

Please note "BBC Breakfast with Frost" must be credited if any part of this transcript is used.

Superintendent Ali Dizaei - the senior Metropolitan Police Officer

DAVID FROST: Superintendent Ali Desai is one of the most senior ethnic minority officers in the Metropolitan Police, but he is currently prevented from doing his job.

Earlier this year a court cleared him of corruption charges after a major investigation into his conduct, launched by, in fact, fellow officers.

But Superintendent Desai still faces a number of internal disciplinary charges which means he is suspended from duty until they're resolved.

He says that the case against him was motivated by racism and that a handful of people set out to destroy him, and he says black people shouldn't join the Met.

Now, Ali, they had thirty charges that they were looking into with you, but when it actually came to court both of them were relatively minor. The two charges you were cleared of.

ALI DESAI: Firstly my car was vandalised and the question was where it was parked, and I appeared before the highest court in the land, the Old Bailey, before the highest criminal judge in the land, accused of giving the wrong location - the difference being 180 yards.

DAVID FROST: And the other one?

ALI DESAI: The essence of the other one was that I should have taken the M4 into London rather than the M40, and by doing so I inflated £250 of my mileage over four years.

DAVID FROST: And now, the other key point you make here is that those two charges came out of an investigation that had cost anything between £2million and £7 million. Is that right?

ALI DESAI: Absolutely, and it involved something like 40 police officers and went across three continents and basically employed one of the most sophisticated surveillance techniques known to police forces up and down the country.

DAVID FROST: And there was also a moment in the court case, wasn't there, where in fact your QC, Michael Mansfield, had to say that he couldn't really defend the way that you had attacked on the phone, one of the calls that was bugged, and you said to a girl who'd given you up, you know, you're dead meat from here on, and so on.

ALI DESAI: Well, I ..

DAVID FROST: Do you regret that?

ALI DESAI: The fact of the matter is, 44 officers crawled over my private and personal life over four years, and spent £7 million of taxpayers' money, and the best they could come out with is that I had some unpleasant telephone conversation with an ex-partner in 1998. It's a conversation that I very much regret and perhaps with benefit of hindsight I would have dealt with the matter differently.

But really, this is not about Ali Desai's personal life. This is about, I think, abuse of executive power, because clearly Parliament has given the police service a number of tools to deal with terrorism and major organised crime.

It's important to know that I did not actually appear in court for corruption at all. I appeared in court because of taking the wrong route into London. And I think if, it is laughable if it wasn't so serious, that still in day and age this could actually happen.

DAVID FROST: But at the same time, I mean, as you look at the Metropolitan Police today, you are urging people, ethnics, not to join the Metropolitan Police. But they have made progress, they have worked at the question of, since they were accused of institutional racism, they have worked at it haven't they? And nearby we now have a black Chief of Police for Kent, and so on. So there is some progress here.

ALI DESAI: Absolutely. And, you know, there can be no doubt that the Metropolitan Police has made huge inroads and they have community safety units to deal with race crime in every borough in London.

And police officers go to race relations training. So there has been huge inroads by very dedicated police officers. But this is not about the Metropolitan Police.

This is only about the handful of officers who set out, as I said previously, to destroy my life, my career, and actually destroy the National Black Police Association. And I think that's the key. It is not a reflection of the Metropolitan Police or senior officers nationally.

DAVID FROST: Yes, because I've interviewed Sir John Stevens on a number of occasions and I would say confidently, there is not a racist bone in his body.

ALI DESAI: Sir John Stevens is a very admirable person and very competent Commissioner. And I don't think what has happened is a reflection of the Commissioner at all.

But unfortunately there are people who work under his command - only a handful - who are unaccountable, untouchable and Operation Helios is a demonstrative example of how unaccountable and how untouchable they are.

DAVID FROST: What about the situation now? I mean, if the situation between you, there's these internal charges we hear about, are they as minor as driving the wrong way into London, or are they serious?

ALI DESAI: I can assure you David, if they had any hint of seriousness I would have been before the Old Bailey and not at the internal discipline. I believe they are relatively minor and I am disappointed that another £2 million worth of taxpayers' money is going to be spent for a three months internal discipline.

I really and sincerely hope a line can be drawn out of this and a learning for the police service can come out of this so we can actually move forward.

DAVID FROST: Now, you're suing them on grounds of racism and so on, the Metropolitan Police, and so on. Obviously this, what I'm about to say couldn't happen until that was resolved one way or another. But has the day gone now when you could go back, if there was a settlement of your dispute suing them, could you ever go back and serve in the Metropolitan Police, or had whatever image you want, too much water gone under the bridge?

ALI DESAI: No I would like to go back to the Metropolitan Police, the police service is something that I've dedicated the last 18 years of my life to. It's still an admirable service and I still would like to go back but I do believe that I have a contribution, albeit a small one to make to the people of London and frankly I would like a line to be drawn underneath because I seen the collateral damage this case, and many other cases, causing to the legitimacy of policing in London is huge. And I'm delighted with David Blunkett and his team to have realised that, and intervene, to draw a line underneath this.

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