Are trains too expensive?

More than half a million rail commuters could face substantial fare increases for the first time in almost a decade.

The Strategic Rail Authority, which is struggling to cover the cost of running the network, is to abolish the price cap on season tickets, according to The Times.

The Rail Passengers Council says that increasing the cost of travelling by train would be a "dumb move" and that commuters should pay their fair share but only if "the railways are delivering a decent service, which they are not at the moment".

What do you think of the cost of train tickets? Would higher prices put you off travelling by rail? Should companies be allowed to charge what they want?

Thank you for your e-mails. This debate is now closed. A selection of your comments is published below.

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I remember the days of commuting from Tunbridge Wells to London. A 50 minute journey cost approximately £2,600 per year for the privilege of an overcrowded and poor service. I now live in Berlin and commute every day to work. A journey of 40 minutes which costs £500 a year. This price includes ALL bus, tube and rail travel within the city and its environs 24/7. The service is excellent as are the trains. Now wonder the correspondents here are so fed up. If I were in the UK again I would buy a car too! What are the SRA thinking? Good luck fellow commuters.
James, Berlin, Germany. ex UK

Things here, while being far from perfect, are not actually that bad in comparison

Andrew, London, UK

Have all these people extolling the virtues of train travel abroad actually tried it? I've been Inter-railing so have travelled on most of Europe's railways. Most trains are at least as dirty as ours, the services late and rather than there being trains once or twice an hour there is one or two a day. Finally to travel on a train which doesn't stop absolutely everywhere you have to pay a supplement. Things here, while being far from perfect, are not actually that bad in comparison.
Andrew, London, UK

I think the rail industry is holding the general public to ransom - most city workers living outside London simply have no choice but to use the trains, what other choice is there!? You can't drive - Mr Livingstone has ruined that particular avenue of pleasure with his congestion charge. I've no doubt that when this scheme goes ahead that people will still fork out money hand over fist for the same badly run, inefficient services. How can you justify huge price hikes in an economic downturn when people's wages are not rising to compensate?
Duncan Ireland, UK

I had to travel from Bridgend to Newport in S Wales last weekend - price on the train £8.50, in the car about £2.50 in petrol. The restaurant on the station was disgusting and there was a total lack of information. Pay more? No way I'm off to fill up my tank!
Stephen, Wales

Of course trains tickets are too expensive! I'd rather go by coach. You see the front doors of the country instead of all the back gardens, compost heaps and tipped rubbish over the fences. Anyway it's doing the exact opposite of the government plan. Cheaper coaches filling up the roads that are already choking.
Stan Cooper, UK

It's not even a question of a fair service. I'd like to know what happened to the Eurostar links we were all promised in the north when we got stung for the subsidies for that to bail out the building of the Channel Tunnel.
Ed Hartley, Carnforth Lancashire

The service and the trains have improved dramatically since privatisation

Bob, England

People say the railways should be nationalised - they are obviously too young to remember BR - there where huge delays, poor service and rude staff. Maybe I'm lucky but in the Chiltern area the service and the trains have improved dramatically since privatisation. As for trains being filthy - that's often down to the passengers - I would hate to see some people's cars!
Bob, England

A friend of mine works for Connex, and was recently late for work (their employees are fined when they're late). He was seriously told by his manager "You can't depend on the trains to get to work on time"... and recommended that my friend buy a car. (I'm not joking!)
John Neal, Southampton, UK

I live in Darlington and travel to York three times a week. Journey distance there and back? Around 110 miles. Price £10.30. Travel time? 25 minutes each way. My only comments therefore would be that travelling on train on the east cost main line is OK and is certainly cheaper than driving down to York and spending 30 minutes travelling the last 3 miles. However when things go wrong delays can be for hours, more backup for when problems arise would be a welcome change.
Andrew Togher, Darlington, England

Allowing a company to charge what it wants is not necessarily a bad thing. The prices are already too high for what is a third class service in this country. I personally have not used trains as a means of transport here in the UK for over 20 years and do not see that changing. They are dirty, slow uncomfortable behemoths. There is no comparison between this country and just about anywhere else in the world.
Keith, Sunderland, UK

There is no way I would be prepared to pay even more for what is frankly an inadequate service. The prices went up a while ago, and yet I've seen no improvement in the service. When I can be assured of actually getting to work on time by following the timetable rather than leaving half an hour earlier than it recommends, when I get to sit with the ticket I've paid for and when coaches stop looking and smelling like public toilets, then I'll consider paying more. Not very likely though!
AB, Birmingham, UK

I am lucky to get a seat

James, Leeds, England

Train prices are ridiculous at present anyway. When I do travel by train, I am lucky to get a seat. An increase in ticket prices cannot be justified unless the service is improved (more carriages so paying customers get the seat they paid for). I doubt however, that this will be the case, and that the ticket price increases will fund the ongoing repairs that should have been made a long time ago.
James, Leeds, England

Last year, I planned for myself and my wife to go to Blackpool by train. The price? £158. The journey time? 7-8 hours. Instead, we took the car. Journey time? 6 hours up and 7 hours back. Price of petrol? £40. And they want the fares to go up?
Stephen Roberts, Llanelli, South Wales

Almost all of the problems can be traced back to privatisation - John Major's final little legacy to the UK. It won't fix the railways, but is there no way of prosecuting those who flogged them off to private companies? It might at least discourage future privatisations of public goods and services.
Stephen, Northampton UK

How therefore can they justify increasing fares?

Angela Rich, Potters Bar, Herts

Our local community is commemorating a year since the crash here that killed 7 people and injured many more. The cost to local businesses was enough when the main road was closed for a couple of weeks after the crash. They don't agree they are "liable". How therefore can they justify increasing fares? They can't take responsibility when something goes wrong. Why should the fare paying passenger have to fork out even more to sit waiting for trains that never arrive and when they do....sit and wonder if they are safe while on it?
Angela Rich, Potters Bar, Herts

They should keep the long distance, high speed (120mph) routes and turn the rest into private roads reversed for high speed luxury coaches. It will cost a faction of the price and if a coach breaks down you just go round it rather than wait for an hours for someone to fix it!!
Stephen, Tunbridge Wells, Kent

I have been living in Australia for a couple of years. Transport is far more affordable, and runs so much more efficiently. Although peak hours are crowded, we do not experience the cattle truck style of UK. Improve the service before putting up prices.
Christine, Australia

Now we are told that there are too many people on the trains

Jonathan Bryce, Reading, UK

A few months ago, we were told that there were too many people on the roads, so a congestion charge was necessary to encourage people to travel by rail. Now we are told that there are too many people on the trains, so a ticket price increase is need to presumably encourage people to travel by road. I guess there must be some logic in there somewhere, but I can't see it.
Jonathan Bryce, Reading, UK

The train is really an anachronism. Its time was in the 19th century, and the early part of the 20th. Right now it is expensive compared to other modes of transport. I have seen estimates that long distance rail costs twice as much per seat passenger mile as air travel. Rail can't compete anymore and should be allowed to die a "partially" dignified death and new solutions to travel sought.
Steven Groenveld, Varese, Italy

Let the operators set the fares to what they want to and face the consep transport, education, health-care, people etc, etc.
John, Kings Langley, UK

It currently costs almost £5 for a return ticket to my work - a journey that takes only 11 minutes. If the city council or government think they can get me out of my car and onto public transport at these prices, they are in fantasyland.
Stephen Daniels, Edinburgh, Scotland

No wonder Britain is heading for gridlock!

Robert Butler, Bordeaux, France

When will the UK ever learn that charging more for public transport only turfs would-be passengers into cars? Here on the continent, public transport is cheap and reliable. And here in a thriving city like Bordeaux, that's partly because politicians actually regard traffic congestion as their problem. It's not even a question of whether public transport is cheap, so long as it is at least affordable. The system is integrated without holding the passenger to ransom. And Bordeaux will soon have a tramway - simply because the politicians had the forethought to realise that it was either that, or face endless traffic chaos. No wonder Britain is heading for gridlock!
Robert Butler, Bordeaux, France

I used to be a regular rail user. If I return to my home town of Nottingham for the weekend it costs £85 for the return ticket. To drive costs £20 in fuel. Why take the train?
Steve Moore, London

I'm trying at this moment to work out the best way to get from Manchester to London for a meeting on Saturday - a journey which I don't look forward to as it involves the best part of four hours travel each way. When operators deliver a service which doesn't fill me with dread then I may agree to paying a little more for it, but not a moment sooner.
Christine Burns, Manchester, UK

If there is no cap on ticket prices there should be a cap on the amount of profit rail operators make. This would hopefully mean more money reinvested.
James Pearson, Gravesend, Kent

Re-nationalise "public" transport!! The Government say they want to reduce car congestion; yet whilst train prices go up, the number of trains running and the number of coaches is reduced. Car parking at stations is exorbitant when you can get a space, buses suffer the same problems where the service exists and still the government want to tax us out of our cars. Give us a viable alternative!
Anna Dovey, Haslemere, Surrey

I'm not prepared to pay for a service that is stuck in the Dark Ages

Mark Harris, Whitstable, England

I travel everyday to London for work and my monthly standard season ticket is £294 - per month! If they increase it by much, I shall look for work elsewhere as I'm not prepared to pay for a service that is stuck in the Dark Ages. It is a hopeless, dirty, always delayed service that I wouldn't want to wish on anyone. So much for getting people out of cars and onto public transport, seems the way forward is more cars, more pollution, and more global warming.
Mark Harris, Whitstable, England

The privatisation of the railways was another example of an artificial free market and they don't work - look at the NHS and the nuclear industry. The railway companies have no real competition, are not required to invest in their business and the government doesn't want to either. I already spend a small fortune, compared prices on the continent, to use a service which is frankly appalling and which certainly doesn't treat me like a 'customer'. The railways in this country are national disgrace and I think its time the government woke up to the fact that a first world service economy with flexible labour laws needs to facilitate citizens travelling around the country not penalise them for working away from home.
Chris Patterson, Falmouth, Cornwall

I am a regular train user and have actually found that services have improved in the last two years, especially along the West Coast line. The new Virgin trains are a very high standard. Nevertheless, I feel the prices are already too high, so an additional increase seems unjustified. To compete with cars at the current higher prices, train journeys have to be quicker, more comfortable and more reliable than car journeys. At the moment they are barely competing on any of these criteria.
Martin Smith, Oxford, UK

Just Travelled from Cheltenham to Parents House in Shropshire. Taxi to Station - £5. Train Journey - £29. Taxi from Station - £16 Total Cost £50. Journey Time 3.5 hrs
Travelled by car on the way back Cost £10 Journey time 2 hrs Why would I use the train only if there is no alternative. How can the cost be justified - at three times more expensive than travelling by car?
Edward Logsdail, Cheltenham Glous

I have commuted to work by train for 5 years. How will ordinary people with ordinary jobs afford to continue working in London when the cost of living increases and salaries do not? This is about more than just trains - we'll run into serious problems if our economy continues to rely upon the South East of England as the heart of business. Putting up the train fares will not resolve these issues.
Caroline, Godalming, Surrey

A complete overhaul is needed

Neil, ex-UK

I used to commute from central London to Guildford every day of my former rat race life. The fare is already extortionate, the service is unreliable and filthy. More money is not going to change the situation while the same people are pulling the strings. A complete overhaul is needed. Rail tracks must not cross one another for simple safety concerns (Paddington) and timetables must be enforced by fining the appropriate companies at fault. The country and its public services are regressing and rather than watch them slide away I chose to move away. So I urge commuters and tourists to challenge the rise in fares with a unanimous NO!
Neil, ex-UK

Surely it would be reasonable to demand that all rail managers travel to work on their trains each day. That way delays and overcrowding might be more than a statistic.
James, London, UK

You cannot completely serve public interest and private profit. We were promised an improved train system when BR was privatised, just as we are promised one for the tube. But the result was and will be a system which is neither a public service, nor value for money. Money for re-nationalising the trains should come from another source than our pockets. Perhaps MPs should stop paying themselves more? If the political will was there, the money would be found. If the Government held up their hands and admitted defeat, it might prevent other future privatisation disasters like the Air Traffic Control, Royal Mail and the tube. It's time the Government addressed the rail system properly and stopped trying to treat a severed leg with a band-aid.
Peter Stead, London, UK

I agree that pushing the price up is a bad thing. But one or two things need to be noted. Firstly, a lot of often unnecessary extra burdens and restrictions have been placed on the rail companies by the new Network Rail (nationalisation by the back door?), thus making it harder for them to provide a quality value for money service. Secondly we need to see things in perspective. European trains may be cited as cheaper and are usually faster, but when I had to travel from Saarbrucken to Calais by train recently, the trains were filthy, and had I missed my train I would have been stuck in Saarbrucken for up to 24hrs, such is the poor service.
James, Oxford

There is absolutely no way the cost of rail travel in any way reflects the quality of service we receive here in the South. The prices are already extortionately high and take into account the filthy and outdated trains and technology and the inability of the train operators to make the trains run on time spell a disastrous service... for which I find it enraging to pay for in the first place. Also, students should get a discount with an NUS card rather than having to buy a rail card for it.
Setti M, Southsea, UK

I guess there's a bit of a Catch-22 - we're only willing to pay higher fares once there's a better service, but the SRA claim that they need more income from fares before they can improve the service. So how about they, say, increase the fares by 25%, but give you a 50% discount if you don't get a seat, and a 70% discount if your train is more than 30 minutes late.
Charlie, Cambridge, UK

I take the train occasionally to commute to work, but only to remind me why I take the risk of my normal commute on motorcycle!
Mark P, Maidenhead, Berkshire

I take the train to work every day. In five years, it has arrived on time twice. I have to stand. There are two trains per hour, and they leave within five minutes of one another. The bus to the train station (which is run by the same company as the trains) arrives five minutes after the train leaves. I'm expected to pay more for this level of service? No way!
Dean Waters, Leeds

I used to commute to London from Woking, saving on rent but paying a whopping £250 monthly train fare. I soon realised that, for the price and for my own sanity it was easier to just move into London and avoid South West Trains altogether. Rail fares are already outrageous, the service is showing no signs of improvement and train companies are in grave danger of pushing their long-suffering passengers away altogether.
Tracey, London UK

I benefit from an exceptional rail service

Tony Watt, Bradford

I would be willing to put up with an increase but only because I benefit from an exceptional rail service. My train to Leeds runs on time, is very modern, has air conditioning and nearly always has a seat free despite being busy at rush hour. I am not even considering buying a car at the moment and the extra money I would spend on increased ticket prices I'd save by not running a car!
Tony Watt, Bradford

Increasing fares is the only option for the Strategic Rail Authority as revenue cannot be generated by fitting more people in! The trains are standing room only and dirty. I would be prepared to pay more for a clean seat with fresh air.
Andrew, Baldock, UK

Railtracks are used only 2% of the time. Let's rip up the tracks and dedicate them to bus services instead. Far more efficient, lower overheads and we could introduce real competition and lower the fares (as in the airline industry). You could also limit these buses to LPG to enhance the environmental aspects.
Mark Murphy, London UK

I would pay an increased amount for rail travel, if it was guaranteed that the service was there

Ian Walford, Brightlingsea

I would pay an increased amount for rail travel, if it was guaranteed that the service was there, and a worthwhile compensation put in place for delays. As it stands, trains have to be one hour late before commuters are given compensation. Would the SRA and train companies find their staff turning up this late acceptable? On my route the compensation paid is £5 when a daily ticket would cost nearly £40. Trains that run, but with fewer carriages don't count even if a twelve carriage train arrives with four. What are the people usually seated in the other eight supposed to do? Not go to work?
Ian Walford, Brightlingsea

Train fares are already far too expensive, I live in Cardiff and occasionally have to travel into Reading for work, the drive takes me slightly over 2 hours and cost under £20 in petrol, I recently had to use the train for this and it cost me around £85.
Simon, Cardiff

We already ARE paying more. Off-peak advanced-purchase deals have become almost non-existent over the last year or so. The companies have used the media's (justified) focus on rail safety to increase fares by stealth. The trains are prohibitively expensive now, even compared to one or two people making the same journey in a car. Another privatisation disaster.
Jon Hall, Reading, UK

Whenever I visit the UK I hire a car

Leam Murphy, Brussels

Whenever I visit the UK I hire a car. This is the cheaper method. The train service does not exist in my opinion - it is absolutely dreadful. How can a rise in fares help the government's plans to encourage use of public transport?
Leam Murphy, Brussels, Belgium

I travel on the Brighton to London line daily. The service is often slower than scheduled, plus I have to stand most of the time. Even when I do manage to sit, it is on a dirty and worn out seat. My wife is from Sweden and she cannot believe what we put up with here. So firstly I'd like value for the current amount of money I pay out please! Higher the price by much and I'll take to the [congested] roads.
Andy, Haywards Heath

I arrived late into work again today because of train delays, and was astonished to read of these fare rises when I logged onto the BBC website. I pay £3,300 for my season ticket per year for an absolutely abysmal service. I couldn't afford to buy a house in London, so had to move away from the capital. For the overcrowded services, filth, very severe delays, cancellations and poor customer service, this rise is an absolute joke. Or is it in fact April 1 today?
Rachael, Oxfordshire, UK

In no other European country do citizens pay rail fares of the kind they do the UK

John Gray, London, UK

In no other European country do citizens pay rail fares of the kind they do the UK - they are already too high. In addition, the service is generally poor and the trains filthy. Having to pay more for the ordeal of travelling by train in Britain would be a high incentive for many to consider alternative forms of transport.
John Gray, London, UK

Yes I would object at paying more, currently I travel into London a couple of days a week and it costs £12 return, for a full train with standing room only. I thought the government wanted us to use public transport. How can a price rise 3% above inflation for the next 20 years persuade people to use the train instead? I also cannot see how the fares do not pay for the upkeep of the railways. There must be a very big black hole where money is being dumped, probably the directors' pockets.
Simon Robinson, Brentwood, UK

I commute to work on the train every day and as it is the service is appalling and season tickets very expensive. If the prices increase much I will consider driving into work, as this will then be the cheaper option. At this day and age with global warming and air pollution both major issues this is ridiculous, we should be encouraged to use public transport! And I don't think that companies in public service should be allowed to charge what they want, I work in the water industry and we are certainly regulated in what we can charge.
Daniela, Yateley/Hants

I think raising the price of train tickets even higher is ridiculous. Who in their right mind would prefer to sit on a dirty, cramped unreliable train when they could drive for half the price and twice the comfort? Public transport in this country is a joke and until it is vastly improved I will be continuing to drive my car wherever I go.
Richard Bosley, Bournemouth, Dorset

Perhaps, our experts may decide to visit some other countries to find out how to offer a good service with competitive prices

Marco Milone, London, UK

We tend to think that by increasing the income all problems are solved. Well, it is not that simple. I come from a country in Europe where trains are cheap, fast, and secure unlike the UK. Perhaps, our experts may decide to visit some other countries to find out how to offer a good service with competitive prices. And remember, people are willing to pay for good services.
Marco Milone, London, UK

A new £10 minimum fare has recently been introduced for tickets purchased on weekdays using the Network Railcard. In this way, the cost of off-peak travel in the South East has already effectively increased by 50% in the past year. We're still suffering infrequent and unreliable services, particularly to smaller stations.
Andrew, Redhill, England

The price to travel on trains around here is already too much at the moment and an increase would make me not use them at all. People will always use their cars if the alternative is more expensive.
Simon, Marlow, England

Train fares in this country are too expensive. I travel to Scotland every week. I fly, the train would cost more and take ten times longer. European train networks are cheaper and easier to use, but they heavily subsidised by the national governments in question. For comfort take the train, for speed take the plane.
Ian Simmins, UK

When I spend time in the UK at some point, I usually have to use trains. I am most often shocked and disappointed with the service. During my last two visits to the UK I have had pre-booked tickets, trains have been cancelled and I have lost my seats. I have never received a refund. I would rather hire a car in future than pay more for a substandard service.
Penny Gosling, Hong Kong

We are already paying quite a lot of money for a poor service. This is absolutely a bad move for people like me who don't have much choice other than rail service for commuting long distance on a regular basis.
S Chakraborty, Cambridge

I have been using the train services to Gatwick Airport for the past 3 years and have recently had to pay an increase on my monthly ticket price. Although the service is at about 80% reliable I often find that many folk have to make do with standing all the way to the South Coast at rush hour due to high demand and lack of carriages. I would prefer improvement before price hikes
Colin, Brighton, UK

I used to commute to work each day by train/bus but found them so unreliable and costly that I moved jobs. I now work further away but spend far less running my car. I also have more time with my family as I do not leave early/home late like I did with public transport.
Sarah, Chester, UK

The problem is I object to the whole structure - we as taxpayers still fund the railways, while the rail companies make profits and pay shareholders! This is not privatisation - it is a license to steal! Scotland should turn Scotrail into a non-profit Trust and run it for the people of Scotland, not for shareholders!
Marty, Scotland

Yes, yes and another YES! If the trains get any more expensive I'm going to have to get back into my car, especially on the East Coast line, the GNER Kings Cross to Edinburgh route is the most overpriced train service in the country! They need to cut fares, not raise them, or people like me will just abandon them altogether.
Thomas Yasin, UK

A price rise? No way! Having lived abroad and experienced a reliable, on time, clean and honest train network where tickets cost 1/10th of those here, I can't believe they are discussing this. The price rise will push more passengers away which will require more price rises. Make the prices cheaper and they might get more passengers. Then they might be able to start doing something about how dire the service is....
Lee Butcher, Bracknell, Berks

About once a month I travel up to Nottingham by train. This involves numerous delays cancellations. On Virgin Trains I don't bother to find a seat anymore and stand near the doors as the trains are always overcrowded. I feel like I am the profit margin when I stand. For this privilege I pay about £30 (With my Rail Card). If prices goes up whilst the poor service continues, then I will probably consider buying a car as it is just less stressful then travelling by train.
Harry, Bath

Train prices in the UK are already extortionate and are some of the highest in Europe. Train travel is expensive. The network needs serious modernisation and I think this can only be achieved by a one of upgrade subsidy from the government. Lets get a better service before we pay more.
Jon, London, UK

To charge more can do nothing but push more people off the trains

Richard Butler, London, UK

While the rail service in this country remains chaotic and inept there can be no justification for price rises. Many train operating companies provide a woeful service that cannot be relied upon. To charge more can do nothing but push more people off the trains. The Strategic Rail Authority proves again to be a witless, incompetent and ignorant watchdog.
Richard Butler, London, UK

I could handle higher fares, if the service modernised. By that I don't mean newer trains etc. but trains there when you want/need them something like a 24 hour super tube service. Now there's a thought, people will happily spend a fortune on new cars because they are always there and I suppose more secure. Time for new thinking?
Keith, UK

When will these companies realise that a public transport system cannot be a profit making enterprise. We must have government subsidisation for the rail networks to get more people on the trains or the system will all collapse.
Paul, London, UK

This would be a crisis. Outside of London, most of us have to take the car to get to the station, where it costs a fortune to park. The very crowded, and deeply unpleasant journey into work then costs another fortune - quite an insult. Raising the costs even further makes the whole public transport argument laughable, and commuting to London a really spirit crushing experience for a huge part of the UK population. No wonder there are so many programs on TV about moving abroad and getting away from it all.
James Saull, Woking, UK

Most of the extra cash raised that way goes in supporting the share price and chief executives ludicrous no performance related pay packets, not improving the congestion and poor service!
Phillip, UK