BBC NEWS | Talking Point | Forum | Six Forum | Six Forum: Firefighters' strike

The first firefighters' strike in the UK for twenty-five years is due to take place on Tuesday, 29 October.

The industrial action is part of a campaign by the Fire Brigades Union to secure a 40% pay rise, which would see salaries for fully qualified staff rise to about £30,000.

If the strikes go ahead, the army - backed by Royal Navy and RAF personnel - is on standby to provide cover with 827 ageing 'Green Goddess' fire engines.

But deputy prime minister, John Prescott, has warned that "the risk of loss of life and property will be higher" as response times will be slower.

The FBU is meeting today to decide whether it will respond to emergency calls during the planned strikes.

How will the strikes affect you? What precautions should you take? Are the Green Goddess fire engines up to the task?

Your questions were answered by Deputy Managing Director of the Fire Protection Association, Chris Mounsey in a forum for the BBC's Six O'Clock News. A recording of the forum will be available here shortly.

Transcript

Manisha Tank:
Welcome to the Six Forum. We're talking about UK firefighters. They'll be going on strike action - it's over pay. The Fire Brigades Union is looking for a 40% increase in earnings.

The union is also still debating whether it will respond to emergency calls on the days of the strikes. Meanwhile the army, backed by the Royal Navy and RAF personnel, are on standby to provide cover. But what does the strike mean for you? What precautions should be taken and will the Green Goddesses be able to cope?

Answering your questions, Chris Mounsey, deputy managing director of the UK's national fire safety organisation, the FPA.

Chris thanks very much for being with us. There has been a great deal of interest in this subject and a great deal of concern.

We'll start with an e-mail from Cliff Blacker, Bristol: Are the planned strikes for more than one day at a time?

Chris Mounsey:
As we understand it, there's going to be a series of strikes. Initially two strikes for 48 hours and then subsequently as we lead up closer to Christmas, there are going to be periods of eight day strikes interspersed with eight days of no strike. So that's going to take us all the way up to December so obviously over a substantial time there is going to be a significant risk.

Manisha Tank:
Obviously all of this depending on whether an agreement is reached or not. Meanwhile many people are concerned about different sectors of the country and how they work - different areas of everyday life and whether they can actually operate without the firefighters on standby. For example, Mike, Haywards Heath asks: How will the strike affect road safety?

Chris Mounsey:
I think that's a very good question and it should be a concern for everybody. The contingency arrangements which the Government have put in place obviously will help to a point. But the equipment that they have available and indeed the service personnel don't have the same expertise that the fire service have and of course they cover road traffic as well as flood incidents and so on.

So there will be difficulties there and we do feel that people should be obviously extra vigilant. They need to take very much greater care when they're driving - more so than they would normally - particularly on motorways and so on where they are relying on the fire service, in this case, the contingency arrangements, to get often get them out of very dangerous situations.

Manisha Tank:
Now obviously then the ability to do the job as it were is of great concern to people who might need the fire services. Angela Woodward, Guilford: So why can't the soldiers use the red fire engines that are used regularly by the fire service? Are they the personal property of the striking fire-fighters?

Also Elizabeth, Norwich asks: Why can't the fire engines be used by forces personnel? Everyone accepts that the Green Goddess is not up to the job.

Now there was a concern that the ladders on the Green Goddess engines are only 45 feet and does that suggest that they can only reach heights of say 10 storeys of particular buildings?

Chris Mounsey:
Another very good question. Obviously the Green Goddesses are fifty years old or more. They haven't got on them the equipment that the fire service has available to them. So indeed they're not going to be able to cope with the same sorts of problems that the fire service would be able to cope with.

But I don't think it's a question of them not being available to the armed services and so on, it's a fact that the services will be not be trained adequately to use the specialised equipment. So really even if they had access to the fire engines in the first place, the equipment is so sophisticated that the training needed isn't available to the servicemen at this time.

Manisha Tank:
Kaye, Hammersmith, London: During the last fire brigade strike, people were encouraged to have sand and water buckets in their homes. Is that necessary now?

Chris Mounsey:
It's actually still very good basic advice. But our advice really would be as soon as you discover a fire, either through a smoke alarm or through identifying smoke or whatever else - you actually get out of the house - you exit as soon as you can. You then dial 999 and you only actually try to deal with the fire if you are absolutely confident you're trained properly and indeed you've checked that you can exit from the premises in the event that you're unable to control the fire.

Manisha Tank:
But then what about taking precautions in advance. What should people do? Where can they find out about they need to do and where to get the equipment - sand for example?

Chris Mounsey:
Well a builder's merchant is an obvious choice. But also in addition to that, I think there are a whole range of prevention measures that people can take, both in terms of homes and businesses. You need to check your smoke alarm. If you are in any doubt about the battery being live, then change it. Make sure that your protection system is working in the first place. Use fireguards, ensure that open fires are under control and don't, of course, leave your children unattended. Lots of people fry chips and that's an absolute hazard and it's one that we would encourage people not to do. Use oven chips or use the local chippy.

Manisha Tank:
Alison Ferris, London: I work in a large day nursery. How can I ensure that the children are safe on the strike days?

Chris Mounsey:
This is a very difficult one and I think it applies to lots of businesses. But basically I think at this stage you need to undertake a very simple risk-assessment - see what hazards present themselves in your own workplace, see whether that's going to be a threat, see whether it's actually going to comprise you being able to escape in the event that you're warned of a fire through a detector or through some other means.

So it's an individual choice that has to be made. You have to look at the risks on an individual basis. You can get advice on that. We in fact at the FPA have a website which is available and also the ODPM, through the National Community Fire Safety Centre, has lots of advice for home owners and businesses which can also be accessed. So the information is there, we just need people to be aware of it and to use it in practice.

Manisha Tank:
We've been trying to gauge how our online viewers feel about safety. While we've been on air, you've been voting and you've been telling us how it is you feel about safety during the strikes themselves - 46% are saying that you are not worried about your safety.

Chris, should people feel safe or are you surprised that 46% of people are saying - actually we don't think we have a problem?

Chris Mounsey:
I don't think we want to create panic. Yes, potentially there are lives and property at risk. But I think if you take basic precautions then we can actually make a big impression on this and in fact we can take most of the risk out of it. If people are aware of the fire risk, they take property precautions, they get out of the house as soon as they establish that there's a fire, they then dial 999 - then they should be protected.

As far as property is concerned, the insurance companies are there and they will provide protection. They have confirmed that protection will continue for the home owner.

Manisha Tank:
But certainly some people will be thinking that an insurance company is not going to run to your door in the terrible event that you might have a fire.

Chris Mounsey:
Unfortunately not. So it's down to the individual.

Manisha Tank:
Gareth Swan, London: I need to travel from High Wycombe into London and around on the Tube on many of the dates the strikes will be taking place. Will the strikes affect this at all?

Chris Mounsey:
I don't think I can answer that entirely at the present time. We've been told that there is a suggestion that in fact all Tubes will have to close down. What I would say is that in the same case as individual businesses, a proper risk assessment has to be undertaken. If there is any doubt about the safety of passengers in the Tube then inevitably, I think, we have to recommend that the Tube be closed. But I don't think that's necessarily going to be the case for every Tube. But there will be some potential disruption.

Manisha Tank:
Margaret Hanson, Richmond: We planning a trip to Germany. We're leaving by Eurostar on 8th December and returning shortly after. What about cover in the Channel Tunnel on those days?

Chris Mounsey:
The union is discussing today what emergency cover will be available and we don't know the answer yet. There are very good systems in place within the Tunnel itself but again, I think, this is down to a proper risk assessment being undertaken. And indeed if there is any doubt about safety then I think we have to take the safe option and we have to consider closing down the Tunnel.

Manisha Tank:
Will there be any ways for people to find out what is affected and what isn't affected on strike days. Where can they get the information?

Chris Mounsey:
We'll be doing all we can obviously to keep people updated and obviously ODPM will be doing likewise. I can't say for sure at this moment what sort of advice will be available and how readily it will be available. But I think it's in everyone's interest, including the union, to actually make as much available as possible so that we can endeavour to protect lives and indeed property.

Manisha Tank:
We have had an anonymous text message which asks: Why is it that no one seems to be letting on that 60% of the country is covered by retained firefighters and there will be no disruption in fire cover?

Chris Mounsey:
I think that's probably more an issue for the retained firefighters union. Obviously at the moment they will be continuing to work. But I haven't got details about where retained firefighters are present or not. So it's difficult at this stage to give a complete answer to that.

Manisha Tank:
It would be quite good for us to have a bit of checklist for people who want to write something down and get a very short idea of what it is they should do.

Chris Mounsey:
As I said earlier, check your smoke alarm first, use your fireguards, avoid frying chips, store any flammable liquids away from sources that leak obviously, before you retire at night switch off all electrical appliances, make sure that all smoking materials are put out property, close all your doors when you go to bed and if double locking doors know where the keys are.

When the alarm goes off - get out first and then make the 999 call on a mobile or using a neighbour's phone. Don't fight the fire if you can avoid it and as you said right at the beginning - very simple advice - as in 1997 - heavy bucket of water and maybe sand available but only use it in an absolute emergency when you feel comfortable that that will deal with the situation, otherwise get out.

Manisha Tank:
I want to just want to go back to one thing which was the smoke alarms. You said to test your smoke alarm. But how do you test your smoke alarm?

Chris Mounsey:
Most of them will have a button which you can test. It will emit a sound which will tell you that the battery is still live. But if you haven't replaced your battery for some time, then be safe, replace the battery.

Manisha Tank:
Thank you for all that safety advice and hopefully people will be listening very carefully. Chris Mounsey thanks very much for being with us.