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Tuesday, 30 October, 2001, 12:05 GMT
Are Israel's incursions justified?
The death toll continues to rise in the latest upsurge of violence between Israel and the Palestinians.
In the past week, scores of Palestinians have been killed and Israel has re-occupied six towns in Palestinian-controlled West Bank. The violence came as Israel retaliated for the assassination of Israeli tourism minister Rehavam Zeevi. Prime minister Ariel Sharon has drawn parallels between his country's actions and the US-led attacks against the Taleban in Afghanistan. But the US is exerting huge pressure on Israel to withdraw its tanks, fearing that its actions will destabilise the global anti-terror coalition. Are Israel's incursions justified? Can the US and other countries do more to stop the bloodshed? This debate is now closed. Read a selection of your comments below.
Your reaction
Arafat has shown irresponsibility and lack of leadership when he failed to crack down on terrorist organisations in Palestinian territories. When a democratically elected official in the Israeli government was assassinated, Israel could not sit back and watch the killers be released in a few days from Palestinian "jail".
Their response is fully justified.
Maggie, USA
Why can't Palestinians protest like Martin Luther King or Ghandi, i.e. non violent and with dignity? Then they will achieve their aims, maybe not tomorrow but sooner rather than later. Arafat must better police his community, although that is obviously a difficult task.
Israeli incursion is regrettable, but how else can they control the terrorists in Palestine, if the Palestinians seem incapable or unwilling to achieve that.
Chaim, Cleveland, OH, USA
Of course they're not! Sharon is shamelessly exploiting the war in Afghanistan to do what he always wanted. I find it shocking that the Israeli army kills so many civilians and no military charges are brought against the soldiers; likewise the increasing number of international laws that seem to not apply to Israel. In the past when it was Israel that bore the brunt of terrorist attacks, I felt that they had made their bed and now had to lie in it... but now Muslim anger has spilled over into the West, and I for one want to see Sharon brought under control because his actions now affect our own security in the West.
MP, Canada
No, they are not justified. A minister was assassinated, that is terrible, I agree, but you cannot hold the entire nation responsible for the actions of a few men. Arafat arrested 33 men the next day. Of course he couldn't extradite them, that would be the downfall of his regime. What Israel needs to do is to pull out of the West Bank, and let this die down so Arafat can get a handle on things and crack down on the extremists like he did after Oslo in '94. Right, he doesn't dare to move against them, since the people in the streets are in a rage, and rightfully so. Israel also needs to stop expanding its existing settlements.
Geoff Levy, New Zealand
Neither the Israeli nor the Palestinian actions are justified any more. They accomplish nothing on either side and kill innocents. However it won't ever stop as long as both sides claim 'self-defence'.
The oppression of the Palestinians should be ended as fast as possible, but it doesn't say that Israel should give the Palestinians all that they want, like returning to the 1967 borderlines or force all the Jews who live in the West Bank to leave their homes.
Roy, France It seems to me that Israel is showing a blatant disrespect for the rule of their own law. Their policy of assassination is abominable. If Mossad can get close enough to kill someone, they can bring him back and put him on trial. That said, the Palestinian response is equally damnable. Sharon appears to be a bloodthirsty maniac and Arafat appears powerless. Israel only increases its future difficulties with this incursion.
People seem to forget that Yasser Arafat quite freely signed an extradition treaty with Israel, and promised to prevent terrorism against Israeli civilians from within his territory.
Arafat cannot deliver. The rule of law does not prevail in his dictatorship. He is afraid of Hamas and Islamic Jihad, so he dare not do what he promised. As such, the killers must be brought to justice by other means.
If Arafat had kept his word, Israel would not have to be in his towns now.
Zak, UK
Sooner or later, Israel and Palestine will have to talk and compromise. Of course they've both got a lot of reason to hate the other side. But if all they do is keep repeating history it will only get worse.
Take a lesson from Northern Ireland. Talk, negotiate, compromise. And then talk, negotiate and compromise again. Maybe all you need now is an 'honest broker' - are you listening, President Bush?
It is about time the world and specially the United States wake up and see what is really going on in the Middle East. Palestinians are, and have been for so long, oppressed by Israel. If the world shows Israel the same opposition to its occupation as they did to Iraq or Serbia, Israel would not dare to do such inhumane acts against the Palestinians in their home Palestine.
John, USA
When Iraq invaded Kuwait and took Kuwaitis hostage, this caused military action by a US coalition as Iraq was accused of murdering and kidnapping Kuwaitis. When Israel commits a similar action in the Palestinian controlled West Bank, they are reported as hunting and arresting terrorists. Therefore, no military or economic
action by any country has been taken or threatened against Israel.
It seems the Israelis have a lot of power throughout the world. No wonder terrorism is so widespread today.
To Peter, USA. You are simply glossing over the situation by equating the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait with the Israeli-Palestinian conflict that has far more deep-seated and complex origins. While one might be justified in asserting that this cycle of violence is a source of ongoing terrorism, history shows that Israel has responded to, not perpetrated, acts of terrorism. Such responses are not rightfully compared to an instance of one country invading another with the intent to overthrow.
Lehavim, USA
How can some of the commentators here compare Israel's actions to the USA's fight against terrorism. The USA aren't just bombing away at Afghanistan, they are bombing specific military targets. They're not targeting innocent people. On the contrary, they're sending humanitarian aid to these people. Israel on the other hand are acting in a totally barbaric inhumane way. The Israeli authorities really don't care if innocent Palestinian people die. I'm sick of people defending this appalling blood thirsty administration which is creating unjust instability throughout the world.
Sari, Nepal/USA
Of course it is not justified. The world is at a crucial crossroads right now. We have a choice. We can talk tough and respond to violence with violence - the Rambo approach to politics. Or we can try and solve the problems that cause the hate and desperation underlying terrorism. Look at Northern Ireland. We have tried both ways, and which way has been more successful? Israel is justifying its murderous attacks by saying it is only doing what the US is doing in Afghanistan. They may be right. If so, the UK should immediately withdraw support for the US operation.
Alex, NJ, USA To Alex from NJ. Who told you that Palestinians are terrorists? They are fighting for their own land and freedom. Do you know how many Palestinian political leaders were assassinated by Israel? When it comes to Israel and America, then you accept retaliations. Can anyone define terrorism? Israel is carrying out terrorism for many years with the support of America. When Palestine fights for her own land taken by Israelis, you call them terrorists. Any nation that bombs another naturally creates millions of enemies. America has repeatedly done that in recent times. We have taken sides in foreign conflicts, offered military assistance and weapons, and even bombed other nations. Our actions have caused the loss of many thousands of lives, including the lives of thousands of civilians. For instance, we now partially blame Afghanistan for what happened on September 11. Have we conveniently forgotten that we bombed Afghanistan and killed many innocent civilians three years ago when we tried to kill Osama Bin Laden?
We bombed Iraq after it invaded Kuwait, yet we supported Saddam Hussein with money and arms when he went to war with Iran. In contrast, we continued to monetarily and militarily support Israel even after it invaded Lebanon and killed thousands of Lebanese civilians. Most Americans know nothing about the effect of our embargo of food and medicine to Iraq. We caused the death of hundreds of thousands of children. This is a wake up call for all Americans. As an American, I feel bad when people just believe what they read and see, without realising the real truth.
I think Israel is justified in hunting down terrorists the same way other states do. This is not an eye for an eye but solid preventative measures to stop those that have many attacks planned from carrying them out. If the Palestinians want to come clean they should allow all foreign reporters free access to stories and the resulting film and photo media they have collected. If I was a Palestinian I would be more terrified by the way their terrorists randomly fire machine guns and automatic weapons, than trained objective IDF soldiers. I sincerely believe that many of the innocent deaths are the result of being caught in cross fire from cowardly terrorists that spray gunfire all over the place.
Ganenthiran, Canada
There is no difference between the USA's actions against Afghanistan and Israel's against a regime in which 70 percent of the citizens and the entire government support suicide bombings, mortar fire and using machine guns against innocent civilians.
Nathan, USA
I wonder how Israelis are rampaging Palestinians while Israel is the focal point of what's happening around the world now. Have they become so powerful that nobody in the entire world can influence them right now even when the IRA has starting decommissioning under pressure from the ongoing campaign against terrorism. I think the killing of one minister doesn't justify deaths on such a large scale and the occupation of another people's land.
Mona, Canada
Most countries have a defined procedure for dealing with criminals that doesn't include shooting fleeing villagers from helicopter gun ships. From the point of view of the Palestinians, who are the terrorists? Who are the oppressed people? Who are the people with no rights? Who are the people who want to be free? Simply, these people are being oppressed.
Are Israel's incursions justified? Of course they are. Self defence means hitting back when you get hit. This is what Israel is doing. This is what the US is doing and it is what every country would do in similar situations. When you play with fire you get burned. No one wants a war but if the Palestinians want to go that route Israel has the right to react. If you don't like the game, don't play it. The Palestinians need to reign in their lot or Israel will do it for them.
The US is being two-faced by bombing Afghanistan on the one hand and criticising Israel on the other. Israel gave the Palestinian authority the choice, stop the terror or we will do it for you, exactly as the US has done. The US is just trying to keep its Arab allies happy.
I don't understand. Israelis assassinated some Palestinians two weeks ago, and there was not even lip service against it. So that's okay with everyone. Palestinians kill a minister, the Israelis roll the tanks in, and start killing innocents as usual. Then they whine that they are surrounded by terrorists. I just don't get it.
JC, USA
I am so weary of this conflict as my feelings grow increasingly in an anti-Israeli direction. Israel is an aggressor, no matter how hard pro-Israeli media plays down that fact. Such conflict cannot be justified, never mind these individual incursions. Israel started this aggression decades ago and is naturally facing resistance. The blame lies with the international community as well who allowed this monstrous modern Israel develop.
Neil Peterman, Israel
It appears that everything is justified now and it seems like it's hunting season all over the world.
No. Israel's actions cannot be justified. They are too harsh. This is not an "eye for an eye". It's more like an "eye for a head". The time has come for the US to seriously evaluate its role in the region. What can be done with two societies bent on destroying the other?
The incursion of Israel into Palestinian territory is a subtle way of extending the 1967 war. If the world leaders do not come forward with a profound sense of justice to the Palestinians, this situation will breed frustration, hatred and more terrorism.
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